Suggestion: Export item and monster data to text files

[Andrettin]

I would like to suggest to the developers to transfer the item and monster data which (as far as I know) is contained in the .exe to text files. This would not only make it easier for the developers themselves to edit items and monsters (as they wouldn't need to recompile the game every time they made such an alteration), but it would also facilitate the community to create mods.

[Elle]

Agreed with this, but I've read somewhere that the dev is only doing this for fun, so I dont hope too much that it will be open to the community. This Belzebub mod would be flooded with D2 conversions, boosts to drops, and boosts to spells.

I agree that the current spells are imbalanced, but I have faith that the dev has a sense of direction and will figure out how to make the best of it. Think about it this way... this mod is already good (why else are we all here?) and was made by 1-2 people. Why ruin it?

I speak from my experience with two roguelikes, ADOM and Nethack (and an offshoot SLASHEM). For all the popularity that Nethack enjoys, it has quickly devolved into Netsink, where there is everything AND the actual kitchen sink, and grenades, and lightsabers, alongside with Excalibur and on and on. On the other hand ADOM was developed by a single guy, who never released his source code. His fans hated that they couldnt get the source code, but ALSO kept finding new tactics and new secrets and new mysteries ten years after developement stopped!

So I would like this to happen, but for the listed reasons, would also prefer it not to happen. This approach comes with many advantages and disadvantages.

[Andrettin]

Agreed with this, but I've read somewhere that the dev is only doing this for fun, so I dont hope too much that it will be open to the community. This Belzebub mod would be flooded with D2 conversions, boosts to drops, and boosts to spells.

I agree that the current spells are imbalanced, but I have faith that the dev has a sense of direction and will figure out how to make the best of it. Think about it this way... this mod is already good (why else are we all here?) and was made by 1-2 people. Why ruin it?

I speak from my experience with two roguelikes, ADOM and Nethack (and an offshoot SLASHEM). For all the popularity that Nethack enjoys, it has quickly devolved into Netsink, where there is everything AND the actual kitchen sink, and grenades, and lightsabers, alongside with Excalibur and on and on. On the other hand ADOM was developed by a single guy, who never released his source code. His fans hated that they couldnt get the source code, but ALSO kept finding new tactics and new secrets and new mysteries ten years after developement stopped!

So I would like this to happen, but for the listed reasons, would also prefer it not to happen. This approach comes with many advantages and disadvantages.

I understand what you mean about the disadvantages, but I don't think they are a big problem. Whatever mods people make won't harm anyone, unless they we are forced to play them :p

The devs are doing a great job, and mods won't detract from that. If a mod is bad, then the solution is just not to play it.

Being able to have moddability in this manner would allow people to make mods with new unique items and etc., as well as experiment with balance.

It would also allow the devs to tell anyone who disagrees with their design or balance decisions that if they want, they can just create their own mod that fulfills their desires.

[BrightLord]

This is already a mod.

Why would anyone want to mod a mod? Sounds too recursive for me.

[Constance]

modception o_O

[Noktis]

Stats in txt? = Easy way to cheating.

Ps.
Andrettin, why you quote Elle's post?

[Jofuss]

I would only ever want to see something like this if they gave up on the project. Until that time I am perfectly content with who is at the wheel and the ultimate direction they are taking it.

[Andrettin]

This is already a mod.

Why would anyone want to mod a mod? Sounds too recursive for me.

Well, modmods are a thing There are a number of modmods i.e. for Civilization 4 mods. And I'm sure many people would be interested. The original Diablo itself already had a number of mods, and I don't see why it would be any different for this, particularly since it is a great improvement on the original Diablo.

Stats in txt? = Easy way to cheating.

Yes, but by cheating people are only ruining their own gameplay experience. It also would take some effort for people to understand how to edit the .txt files, so it wouldn't be as easy as using a trainer or something of the sort.

[Noktis]

Yes, but by cheating people are only ruining their own gameplay experience.

Not in multiplayer mode.

Anyway, answer for your suggestion is:
This will not be implemented. (at least for now)

[Wingard]

Thats a shame, i could spent aloooot of time on balancing spells. :3

[Andrettin]

Yes, but by cheating people are only ruining their own gameplay experience.

Not in multiplayer mode.

That problem could be solved through a checksum system: if the two players' checksum differs, then they wouldn't be able to play with each other. If players do something that increase their stats or give them illegit items and then revert back to the "mainline" version of the game, I imagine that it would be possible to reverse use of this for cheating by doing a simple calculation when a character is loaded to see if stat points are coherent with level obtained and quests completed, and if all items are legitimate in the version currently in play.

Anyway, answer for your suggestion is:
This will not be implemented. (at least for now)

It is a pity, but I understand. Thanks anyway

[blankname]

this is not a mod (unless Blizzard asks), its a remake. idk why you guys dont want to make it mod-friendly

[Jofuss]

Thats a shame, i could spent aloooot of time on balancing spells. :3

Balance on spells is based on an individuals play style and the gear available. This is why balancing spells is never complete in any game... ever.

this is not a mod (unless Blizzard asks), its a remake. idk why you guys dont want to make it mod-friendly

Exactly... This is exactly why this needs to remain closed and as far under the radar as possible...

[Wingard]

Balance on spells is based on an individuals play style and the gear available. This is why balancing spells is never complete in any game... ever.

Dude, if thats so then tell me why does pretty much everyone think that mass dmg spells are less attractive to use than some others? Nova, Immolation, Flame wave, even Elemental. There IS some balancing to do, regardless of personal play style. Or the Sentinel spell (low damage, retarded cooldown, pretty high mana cost for a freeze to every nearby monster which can be achieved also by a single Frozen orb).

[Jofuss]

Balance on spells is based on an individuals play style and the gear available. This is why balancing spells is never complete in any game... ever.

Dude, if thats so then tell me why does pretty much everyone think that mass dmg spells are less attractive to use than some others? Nova, Immolation, Flame wave, even Elemental. There IS some balancing to do, regardless of personal play style. Or the Sentinel spell (low damage, retarded cooldown, pretty high mana cost for a freeze to every nearby monster which can be achieved also by a single Frozen orb).

I'm not saying they can't be balanced better, I'm just saying they will never be balanced

Where you said you could spent "alloooot of time balancing," you're right... it would be a long arguous project that would likely take large amounts of work and time away from the development of features and repair of bugs.

What would probably be helpful though is if people with a lot of time to dedicate to the matter took and studied the cost/damage and usefulness of the various spells and created a well conducted study on what changed could be made to the various spells to make them more balanced. You don't need text files for this.

There were people who felt the cool downs of certain spells were too long, so they were changed.
There were people who felt that charged bolt cost needed to be increased to reduce its viability versus the others of the same "level," so it was changed.
People have complained about the balance of the "lower tier" spells verses the "higher tier" spells as far as damage and efficiency go and they have been modified.

In all of these examples though there really wasn't any real data so the changes have been basically arbitrary. If I had more time to invest in studying this, I would likely go into special areas that are always populated by the same monsters with the same stats, (Wurm Cellar, Chamber of Bone, etc) And clear out the levels using only certain spells, taking note of the time for clearing, the amount of potions used, etc.

This way if you find it takes you 10 minutes to clear the level with lightning using 2 full mana potions, but it takes you 20 minutes to clear the level with blizzard using 10 mana potions, you will have more of a mathematical basis for figuring out the types of changes to suggest. IE increase blizzard damage X% and decrease cost X%... Or maybe you find that lightning is just so much faster and cheaper than fireball, guardian, whatever and that lightning should have its cost increased X% and add a cool down...

There are definitely things we can do to try and figure out how much of a change may bring the spells within closer balance to each other that do not require access to code. Saying "Blizzard, flamewave immolate are useless" is only so helpful. We need to try and have constructive changed to suggest.