My thoughts on Beelzebub

Icefire · Post by **Icefire** » 24 Dec, 2017 11:52

No point keeping it.

Miacis · Post by **Miacis** » 24 Dec, 2017 15:28

So, for how long have you played the game and which character levels you have? I wonder if you've seen the game from different angles.

Icefire · Post by **Icefire** » 24 Dec, 2017 17:37

Hassadar · Post by **Hassadar** » 24 Dec, 2017 22:31

It's sad that you experienced the game this way. My experience with it was a complete different one.
I got quickly to nightmare with every char, found plenty of items (of course not "OP mega items", but you're not supposed to finde those in normal/nightmare) and it really didn't need much grinding if any at all.
I do agree that at some point HD mod gets the way you described (for some classes at least), but not in normal/nightmare. Have you tried lost treasure runs? I played sorcerer first and got him to farm hell lvl 12 and of course LT. Imo sorcerer is so easy to get to hell and is very OP (from there he get from OP to useless pretty fast). But LT and being able to farm up until caves in hell is all you need to get items to bring every char that far with ease.

To ask for how long you've played and how far you've got with each character is a total legit question. Also there are different play styles for each character class so asking if you tried out everything makes total sense. And how could he know what you tried out and what not?

Just as a side note, Asking for serious answers and acting like Miacis is some kind of troll just because he is trying to get more information to evaluate the situation is not what I would call a discussion between adults.

Miacis · Post by **Miacis** » 24 Dec, 2017 23:09

Thanks for your reply, I also won a bet with myself that you haven't touched secon difficulty. I don't know what made you say that you are "VERY skilled at these types of games", but you clearly didn't catch the concept of the game, so, uh, I'd question that statement of yours.
Continuing what Hassadar said, the game changes vastly not only with characters but difficulty levels. In a single-player game you are given the possibility to legitimately exchange the items between your characters. As well as that, different characters are stronger or weaker on diffirent difficulty levels. Even with all flaws of mod's balance (some of which were addressed in Tchernobog), being able to use these tools is clearly a part of intended gameplay. If your characters aren't possible to collaborate with themselves and carry each other when it is needed by getting better items, the game has bested you despite you thinking you are good at it.
Also, if you think that the game with 4 difficulty levels isn't supposed to be a grindfest, you might as well just complete all the quests on normal difficulty and call it a day. Some people just don't like such games and it is completely up to their taste.

PS I think I also should be placing bets on how much difficulties those very skilled gamers have completed when they talk about game balance xD

Icefire · Post by **Icefire** » 25 Dec, 2017 3:08

jcvmarques · Post by **jcvmarques** » 25 Dec, 2017 17:56

I understand your frustration, I had it when I started playing this mod.

But you have to press through. Some bosses might seem overpowered but you can overcome them.

For melee classes for example, gear is very important. In the early stages of the game, Armor Class is crucial to avoid being hit. Use your skills wisely. Insanity spell will help you.

For Rogue/Sorceror, keep your distance. Golem spell is very important for these classes. At least for Sorceror you shouldn't have too much trouble since you can Teleport around and avoid attacks from bosses.

Eventually, you will find better stuff that will allow you to progress through Nightmare.

Good luck

Icefire · Post by **Icefire** » 25 Dec, 2017 22:01

jcvmarques · Post by **jcvmarques** » 26 Dec, 2017 16:48

If you managed to get a Sorceror to Hell difficulty, you can farm the 3 Lost Treasure chests for nice loot. If I recall correctly, you can farm items up to level 42 in Hell and level 58 in Torment.

sergio_cannabis · Post by **sergio_cannabis** » 27 Dec, 2017 13:42

The aspect of "crap items" dropping in later dungeon levels (for me at least) is a way to keep better items rare and I think this keeps many people motivated to play the game.

In my opinion this is just how these kind of games work. You try to find the best equipment, but it will need some/much time to get there.

Icefire · Post by **Icefire** » 27 Dec, 2017 15:42

Sneeper · Post by **Sneeper** » 27 Dec, 2017 15:56

I think once you start playing Nightmare and above you will see more tiers of items.
The original diablo only had 3 difficulty levels, this one has 4, maybe they put most of the utter crap in the first difficulty level because they still needed enough stuff for the remaining 3..

Not saying that justifies it but maybe that's the reason.
I got through normal pretty damn fast with my sorc so i really din't suffer/pay attention to your problem. Besides sorcs tend to be able to do their thing with or without good gear in the first 2 difficulties.

Icefire · Post by **Icefire** » 27 Dec, 2017 16:16

bansheexyz · Post by **bansheexyz** » 27 Dec, 2017 17:47

I agree with pretty much everything the OP says. It's not to rag on what is definitely a great mod and being able to play Diablo again (best graphics and music in the whole series) with a modern engine is great. It's just to point out what still needs improved.

The biggest thing for me is the poor item balancing. Take, for instance, the Rogue and her reliance on the Heartseeker bow, and how much better it is than every higher level bow due to crit dmg and ignore defense. Higher level bows should have higher DPS, period. Yeah, it's cool to have some lower level items retain usefulness. But finding new things that are useful is what loot games are about. Why cap the Rogue at lvl 50 and make future weapons inferior? This happens in virtually every item class in this mod, some low level item is superior to higher ones because it has the right combination of buffs.

I also thought that the skill trees were ho hum. There should be more skills and the skills should be designed to stack. Small amounts of pierce/stun/knockback chance with each level or something. And warriors/rogues shouldn't have to rely on learning magic like they're sorcerors. Give them skills or scale back what they can learn to the spells that are useful to them like teleport and town portal.

sergio_cannabis · Post by **sergio_cannabis** » 27 Dec, 2017 18:15

My first character was a mage. Maybe this is why I haven't had the experience of very slow progress and less useful items that drop for me.

With the mage it was a real fluid progress until torment. And even then, when I found good items in torment I could progress further and kill off diablo on torment as well.

I think if you play any other character than mage (without having an item pool out of which you can choose items for the character you are actually using), it is much more difficult to progress as the game isn't very well balanced.

My thoughts on Beelzebub

My thoughts on Beelzebub

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