Warrior + Assassin experiences/problems

Diablo 1 HD, codename Belzebub - General forum.
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Jarring
Posts: 37
Joined: 06 Aug, 2020 8:00

Warrior + Assassin experiences/problems

Post by Jarring »

I've said most of this in the forums at one time or another, but i felt like compiling it all in one thread. I'm hoping the creator of the mod reads it because a lot of it is just honest critique.

The warrior's Valiant Strike is pretty underwhelming. It actually does a lot less damage than Cleave, so the only reason you'd seemingly want to use it is if your physical resistance isn't capped. It does knockback in an aoe though, so it can be good for getting out of a stunlock when you're surrounded. Also, the 2 minute cooldown on Shield Wall is crippling. It's only use really is to survive against monsters with lightning and/or poison enchant...meaning the only buff on it that matters is the flat damage reduction. the %block chance buff is actually pointless considering block rate. It would be a lot better if it gave block rate instead of block chance for sure...but I think it also needs a lot shorter of a cooldown as well for additional reasons...

At the moment, the Assassin actually has better defensive skills than the Warrior. She gets a damage reduction buff as well, only she can have it up 100% of the time. The passive buff from stealth is applied after using any spell or skill. The only time you wouldn't get it is if you're spotted while in stealth, but all she has to do is teleport out, stealth, and then teleport back in. Teleport breaks her stealth, however, she still gets the buff as long as the assassin breaks the stealth herself. She can also get the same buff from dragon flight, so she can just instantly refresh the buff as it runs out. then rinse/repeat, easy. She gets a damage reduction + movespeed buff 100% of the time, whereas the Warrior has to wait on a 2 minute cooldown for an equivalent buff.

Charge is a LOT better than the dragon flight because it has no cooldown and you can shift+click the ground with it just to move around quick or get out of a stun-lock. Dragon flight has a pretty slow animation so you can't really get out of a stun-lock with it. You'd have to cast Narcosis first or try to walk/teleport out of it first.

Narcosis becomes essentially useless in the later difficulties. At first it was good for chasing down succubi and goatmen archers, but in the later difficulties, their hit recovery is about as fast as its cast animation, so it can't really be used to chase down anything that would run away from you. Its cast animation is kind of weird though, and you can skip it entirely by casting it directly after dragon flight. Really, that's the only way to really put use to the skill in later difficulties. It's kind of difficult to get the hang of, cuz you have to cast Dragon Flight on an enemy, then instantly drag your mouse back to the center in time to cast Narcosis as you arrive so that its seamless.

I feel the only real reason to play a warrior is because unlike the assassin, he doesn't have a damage penalty for wearing a shield. If the Warrior had better defensive skills than the assassin, then she wouldn't need a damage penalty for wearing a shield. I feel that the assassin has been cheated out of a shield. I mean, it would make sense if there were a set of base off-hand weapons that could roll magical rare and unique. At the moment, there are only 2 off-hand weapons in the entire game and they're both level 50. Can you not forgive the assassin for wearing a shield? Do you expect assassins to only be played at lvl 50 and beyond? I thought the assassin was going to be a lot of fun, and she was.. for awhile.

I've only played the assassin and warrior so far of the melee classes, but they've both felt severely crippled. The only good 1 hand weapon until lvl 43 is Zakarumite's Ceremonial Knife, and the upgrade at lvl 43, Fang of Cerberus isn't even that great. I mean, it's pretty damned good for a warrior, but like.. the assassin isn't even supposed to use a shield apparently, so idk what you expect from her.

Glory is really good though... I normally don't like items with a chance to cast spells on struck or striking. Chance on struck is the worse of the two, but I'd prefer not to have either as melee. If you were ever to fight monsters that are lightning or poison enchanted, you're going to have a bad time. Not to mention, sometimes unique monsters can have both enchants, and if it wasn't already difficult enough, that'd make it literally impossible. Sometimes, you can get stuck in an endless loop. I've once got stuck using the Holy Defender as my only chance on struck item. I can't remember the enchant, but I THINK it was just lightning. It MIGHT have been both idk, I just know I had to switch off the shield to kill it. I only used it for a short time and I stopped using it afterwards. I didn't die, but I got stuck on the mob casting immolation about 10 times a second(not an exaggeration). I used almost my entire belt's worth of potions in the span of a few seconds and dropped ALL of the gold in my inventory in the process, but thankfully I never died. I somehow survived the loop to teleport and town portal out. Some chance on struck items are worse than others, like despite Glory having chance to cast Nova on struck, it makes up for it for also having Healing on struck(which is the only good chance on struck affix there is imho) and +%max all res. Blade of Five Suns is probably the worst of all of them, but Dragon's Breach is also unusable as well. Blade of Five Suns is just the worst because Guardian isn't like any other spell that does damage. You can have as many Guardians as you can cast and they shoot fast AF. The interaction is actually fucking nuts. If you accidentally hit a lightning enchanted mob once you're dead, cuz if you move through those lightning bolts afterwards you are dead for SURE. I guess your best bet is actually to just stop hitting it and pray. Wait for the bolts to stop moving, then try to get away. I mean.. or you could just not use the item like a smart boy lol.

Stoneskin is also a bad idea because I think it's bugged or something... I don't understand why it happens, but when a lightning or poison enchanted monster gets stone cursed by stoneskin, the enchant gets super buffed. I've been killed many times using Stoneskin for not teleporting away quick enough after a lightning/poison enchanted monster randomly gets stone cursed. I'm not sure exactly how it happens, but I think it's possible that monster's enchants scale off of their max effective HP. Since Stone Curse buffs their effective HP, it empowers their enchant...effectively quadrupling its damage.

It's kind of ironic. I mean.. practically every chance on struck item in the entire game is a bust. Even Stoneskin's stone curse in some weird ass way.

Also it's kind of weird how physical resistance has different caps based on what type of armor you have equipped. Like, if you look the same way as you did when you were level 1 without any armor on, then your physical resistance is capped at 45%. If it looks like you're wearing a chain vest, then its capped at 55%, and if you appear to be wearing plate armor it is 75%. It's a major bummer because that essentially means Dragonslayer's Cage wouldn't be any good for melee characters despite it having a lot of armor and amazing stats for melee characters.

My warrior is currently using an upgraded 20/50 Rattlecage with only 211 defense, however, his physical resistance is capped at 75% regardless. Putting on Dragonslayer's Cage would reduce my physical resistance by 30% despite it having over 100 defense than my current armor. -_-;

With all of that said, I think the mod would be improved immensely if there were base off-hand weapons, both normal and exceptional, that could roll magical, rare, and unique. I know for sure it would improve the quality of gameplay for the assassin, but I'm sure it would also benefit the Barbarian as well.

Or, you could improve the defensive skills of the warrior, so that the assassin's damage penalty for wearing a shield wouldn't be necessary. Currently it feels as though the assassin only has the damage penalty for wearing a shield because she has 100% potential up-time on a defensive buff that the warrior has to wait 2 minutes for. Meaning her defensive skills are better than the warrior's. So in order to balance the 2 classes, she has a damage penalty for wearing a shield. I don't think it's fair. :(
Kahoder
Posts: 6
Joined: 25 Dec, 2019 12:52

Re: Warrior + Assassin experiences/problems

Post by Kahoder »

I don't know if the devs are going to read your post, but I felt like replying to it. I played enough D1 and Belzebub to at least understand the design decision behind the assassin damage penalty for wearing a shield.

Dexterity is the most overpowered stat in the game. Even in base D1, you get flat AC, flat to hit % and if you are rogue, flat damage. Attack and defense in ONE STAT.

The warrior does not get flat damage from DEX, only STR, the assassin gets flat damage from both STR and DEX.

If the assassin could wear a shield without penalty, she would be more tanky than the warrior while having better DPS.

Obviously, it puts her in that weird place in between warrior and rogue with very few good uniques/set items, but griffon's claw is fairly low level and downright made for her.
Kahoder
Posts: 6
Joined: 25 Dec, 2019 12:52

Re: Warrior + Assassin experiences/problems

Post by Kahoder »

I rechecked with jarulf's guide formulas, I thought the damage penalty was from the base damage and not the weapon itself. I did some testing with my assassin

The assassin base damage is :
(Str+dex)*clvl/150

Which is better than the rogue :
(str+dex)*clvl/200

When wearing a shield, the weapon's damage is added to this base damage formula, as would normally happen.

I couldn't figure the damage formula for not wearing a shield, something seems fishy in the calculations. It does not just adds the weapon's min/max to the base damage. There is probably some sort of multiplier

But in any case, the assassin does not get a penalty for wearing a shield, she gets a bonus for not wearing one.
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